The AUS/CKDMAI split started to fester mid 2004, when I opened my mouth to both CKDMAI and a Townsville based Instructor about the technical standards of a local Instructor, being made into a "Full Examiner." If you want the full story from A to Z, please let me know. I have nothing to hide, a few things I got a little hot-headed over, but nothing to be ashamed of, or to be scared of sharing!

The Aust/CKDMAI split started when, a local 1st DAN Instructor asked me to run a Belt Exam for his students at his school. We picked a date & time in the future, and everything was fine. For this instance, we shall call him "Barry."

Three weeks out from the exam, this instructor stated to me that he would "not require my services" because he was going to get a "guest examiner" in from another town, and didn't need me to come there. The guest examiner, we shall call him "Bruce."

As anyone else would do, you would forget about it, and make other plans, which I did. Then about a week out from the exam, guest examiner "Bruce" decided he wasn't coming up. Instructor "Barry" again requested my services. I tried to get staff to cover me for the evening of the exam in my school, but to no avail. I told "Barry" that I could do it, but that it would have to be Friday Night at 8.00pm rather than 7.30pm as he was requesting, as I has to run my school's classes, and would leave immediately to drive there and run the exam.

To instructor "Barry" this was unacceptable. It would not be 8.00pm, as this was too late. I suggested maybe we could do it Saturday lunctime around 12'ish. This was not acceptable either to instructor "Barry." I offered and explained that it was only 1/2 hour difference, but he said that it was not acceptable. It had to be 7.30pm, the same time my class finished.

Then Mr Pereira is on the phone, yelling about me "refusing to examine his students." I tried to explain that I hadn't refused at all, and that I was trying to work out a time, but that certainly was not "refusal" as he kept putting it. In fact, nowhere near it.

Then I rang Choi to have a chat about it, and he mentions that he's not happy with me because I was refusing to examine students, he had heard off Pereira. I tried to explain it to him, but I don't think he understood.

This petty 1/2 hour, is what started the Aust/CKDMAI split, and as pathetic as that 1/2 was, I was branded a troublemaker by instructor "Barry" to CKDMAI, and they ran with it.

...stay tuned for part 2...

No Offence but are you going to continue the story with more Australian stereotype names? ....."meanwhile when Kylie was throwing a shrimp on the barbie" etc .
I await part two with interest

I shouldn't have to go any further than this. Any art, business or the likes, that has an affiliate or francisee that spends between $2000 and $2500 a month on fees, should at least be talked to before assumption is made.

For the pathetic time of 1/2 an hour (30 minutes for those playing at home), I had the founder and the 2IC both believing that I had refused to examine the students. Because of a pathetic 1/2 an hour, CKDMAI was lied to by, yes, we called him "Barry," and how did they investigate it? By believing it, and getting into me for refusing to test the students.

What I had said, and was trying to work out with "Barry," had been twisted and he had lied to CKDMAI.

Now the fun was about to begin!!!!

It takes great courage to speak up when an injustice has occurred. There are many gutless wonders out there in the real world that leave any organization and even in the corporate world quietly only to allow more injustices to occur to others remaining in the organization.
Many martial arts’ leaders/chief instructors teaches the tenet of Courtesy, Integrity, Perseverance, Self Control and Indomitable Spirit and yet very few literally live by the tenets that they preached to their members!

For the next few days, I started receiving text messages, and requests to hold the exam on the same Friday night at 7.30pm. We had already covered this ground, and I could not get a replacement Instructor at such short notice, and 8.00pm was the earliest that I could physically get there. My Instructors have lives, and Friday is a night when they go out, etc.

The request was treated the same, it could be 8.00pm, or another time we agreed to.

THEN, wow, I didn't see it coming. After a few days of "I need an Examiner," I received an email from "Bruce," stating that the previous weekend, "Barry" had completed a "FULL EXAMINER'S COURSE" and was now a "FULL EXAMINER."

Interesting to note, but up until that point, "Barry" was unaware of this, seeking an Examiner for his students. Let's not let fact and integrity get in the way of a good story. All of a sudden, "Barry" was a full examiner. The day before, he was looking for one, this day, he had become one. Remember, all for the sake of 1/2 an hour.

All of a sudden, "Barry" became the "Examiner" that he was seeking.

So to date, "Barry" had lied to CKDMAI, and then "Barry" & "Bruce" had concocted a story which gave a 1st DAN a "FULL EXAMINER" status. And, I was told, this had been approved by CKDMAI.

Interesting to note, I rang and spoke to Choi, he didn't even know who "Barry" was, let alone that he had become a "FULL EXAMINER." Choi mentioned he hadn't spoken to "Bruce" or "Barry" at this stage, although (we shall call him "Marshall"), the representative from CKDMAI, "Marshall" stated that he had spoken to "Bruce" and because I was being difficult and refused to test "Barry's" students, that he had been advised that "Barry" did a course, and was now a "FULL EXAMINER."

Someone should have told "Barry" this instead of having him pester me for the week. Surely if he truly did the course and it was legitimate, he should have known, or had some clue.

So far, it was all based on lies...

The story just gets better... Stay tuned for the next episode.

Now, this is my opinion, ok, but I believe that the technical standard of "Barry" to be rather poor. Nothing personal, I know he loves "teaching" and loves Choi Kwang-Do with a great passion, but standards are standards.

Leading up to this 1/2 hour issue, I had been ridiculed for failing most of the school that "Barry" teaches in. This is because if the curriculum says "dodge," then I take that literally. It's not optional, it's a requirement in the patterns. When whole school does not dodge, then the problem usually, lies with the Instructor, not the students.

When a whole school does Gold Belt Defence Drill like: Move in (offensively) and block, then chase your partner trying to hit them anyway you can, then there's a problem.

When a whole school does patterns and doesn't know which foot steps where and why, there's a problem.

When a whole school has no clue about Cross-Stepping and fake punch, there's a problem.

When a whole school blocks but doesn't shift body weight, pivot on the front foot, and keep their other guard hand up, there's a problem.

When a whole school stops retracting their legs after kicks because they're too busy chasing Shields, Mitts and their partner to hit them, there's a problem.

When training to be an assistant examiner, writing things like "FAIL" without any authority on the forms, taught me a bit about humility, and about how the Student wasn't failing, the Instructor was.

When the Instructor uses the "F" word in front of students, some kids, there's a problem. Especially when Parents come up and make time to talk to you about the issue of swearing in front of their kids, yes, there's a problem.

When the Instructor ridicules other arts (Eg. TKD) and it's common knowledge about the outspoken-ness of the person (without facts), and you talk to someone at a fair or fete, and they find out you're "Choi Kwang-Do" and they stated that they've already met an Instructor from CKD that said their Belt was worthless, when they were thinking of joining but changed their mind, then there's a problem.

Of course, I could ignore it. The problem is that after starting my two schools, in 1999, both now full-time, with staff, and advertising heavily about the great benefits of Choi Kwang-Do, some of my students cringed, some left, and others refused to train or come to the school when "Barry" or his students were there. This affected me and my school(s). Two professional full-time schools were being affected by this one small club in a little country town 20 minutes drive from one of my schools.

I sent an email explaining that I had an issue with "Barry" becoming an examiner, not because I didn't want him to, not because of any personal reasons, but because the school then stood alone and produced, if they kept going the way they were, poor standard martial arts students with an incorrect concept of Choi Kwang-Do. I sent this to "Marshall" & to "Bruce" who happily banded together with "Barry" to rally and let CKDMAI know that the "trouble-maker who stirred sh*t" ("Barry's" words), should be kicked out.

A call from "Marshall" confirmed this. A call to Choi once again showed that he had no clue what "Marshall" was actually saying to people "in the name of Choi Kwang-Do," or was simply denying it.

The technical standards from what I have seen of "Barry's" students that have dropped in to train occasionally, is still poor.

If you're CKDMAI, how do you respond to one of your Affiliate School Owners with two full-time schools, and providing $2000-$2500 per month income for your business?

You say, that you will follow it up, but if it continues, I'll be kicked out.

Kicked out, for trying to adhere to or keep the standard high. At this point, I stopped paying fees (although I was still putting through submissions), waiting for the issue to be resolved or at least sorted out openly and honestly.

A friend made the comment if you want to know "what to do" then you buy the CKD book, but if you want to know "what to do, how & why" as well, you need the technical manual from Dynamic Self Defence. I have nothing to do with them, but it's seems informative information.

Remember, this whole issue came about because of a lie about 1/2 hour and about me "refusing" to test students. It certainly should not ahve gone this
far, certainly should have been investigated, and the decisions reversed, based on the fact that the whole issue started with a lie. But no, ...till next time...

CairnsCKD, it does sound like a very, very unfortunate set of circumstances and that you were treated extremely badly by certain people at the time.

Hopefull now you have told your side of the story it draws a line under events and we can now go back to more "constructive" debate on technical aspects of CKD as a MA?

By now we've all got a pretty good idea of the politics of CKDMAI and how they can sometimes operate but with all due respect its getting a bit repetitive. Its sounds from your posts that you are a talented and dedicated MA-ist/instructor that can give us the benefit of more of your thoughts on CKD "the MA" as opposed to anti-CKDMAI politics (we can go to Roger's site for that). Please, more posts like "try the kup speed drills with the kick first, with a partner for shield/mitt work" - great idea! Fewer posts about "Barry", "Bruce" and "Marshall".

__________________
To give a person an opinion one must first judge well whether that person is of the disposition to receive it or not…………………………
- Yamamoto Tsunetomo

And I was just starting to get into it

I'm sorry mate . It just had to be said.

__________________
To give a person an opinion one must first judge well whether that person is of the disposition to receive it or not…………………………
- Yamamoto Tsunetomo

Yes, more ideas like above please (new thread?).

Don't read on if you don't like stories about "Barry" "Bruce" & "Marshall."



I then received, as part of an "Australia CKD Group" email detailing my financial status by "Bruce" ridiculing the outstanding amount I had with CKDMAI, highlighting that "this can happen to you too" like it was some evil crime.

I immediately rang "Marshall" & read and explained the concepts of the Affiliate Agreement, and the connection with the "Freedom of Information" Act (Australian Law about divulging private & personal details about someone without their written consent), who responded, "what do you want me to do about it"... "do you want me to kick him out."

Damn, should I have said "yes"? Not being a spiteful & vindictive person, I said that he should have words with "Bruce," but an acknowledgement of his wrongdoings and an apology would suffice, instead of a stupid legal battle. Did anything come forward? Not a thing. It's ok though, "Marshall" will be coming to Australia in November or December 2004 to sort it out...

So now, "Bruce" had started planting more seeds in the minds of the Australian Instructors, and "Marshall" did nothing about it, not about divulging financial information, as written in the CKDMAI Affiliate Agreement, not about breaking Australian law, but in an effort to discredit me, and further "Barry's" vendetta and take the heat of the fact that they had lied to CKDMAI about the 1/2 hour testing thing.

Should "Marshall" or "Choi" have had the Integrity and the Interest in Australia, l then it should have been nipped in the bud well before this, but it was starting to appear to us that CKDMAI was a toothless tiger making lots of noise, big-noting itself, but not actually being prepared to step in and make decisions.

All this because of a 1/2 hour lie that they couldn't or wouldn't sort out...

Scaramouch,

Actually this thread is titled "Aus/CKDMAI Split". Therefore, the posts from Cairnsckd are perfectly on topic, and he should be allowed to continue posting his story. In fact, he has not personally attacked anyone, and is simply stating what happened to him. As an ex-CKD instructor and practitioner (with over 9 years in the art) I believe it is very important for people to know the nature of the organisation they belong to, simply in order to safeguard themselves in the future.

Best regards,
Captain Moo Moo

The tension built between me and some of the "Australian" CKD Instructors that some of them could not think clearly for themselves. I received email after email about the breach of the CKD Affiliate Agreement, and how I was being unfair asking for an apology.

It got to the point, with a few too many "I AM YOUR INSTRUCTOR" and "I OUTRANK YOU" emails (being received) from "Bruce" that I was just fed up with all the BS. Remembering that this whole thing started over a lie about me refusing to test students, and then fuelled by an email about the financial status of my school, that was causing tension between some of the CKD Instructors and me. I asked "Marshall" to tell them, NO contact with me. If they chose that path of believing a lie, and want to follow it, and CKDMAI supports it, then fine, just have "Bruce" and them stop contacting and emailing me. The Toothless tiger once again did nothing, and I sent a "please don't email or contact me any more" message to every CKD Instructor in Australia. It wasn't personal, that's why they all got it, it was because I ran two full-time schools, and didn't have time to waste with he said/she said crap (can I say that word here?)

I received an email from one CKD Instructor, who said that I'd "lost the Pil Sung Spirit." From making a stand about being lied about, and bringing it to CKDMAI's attention, being put in may place over, and over again, I had finally had enough. I believe I have a right to teach and run my business my way, and if I don't appreciate lies being spread about me and my dealings with others, if others are not honest enough to be open and truthful about their political desires, then I have a right to step back and take control over my business and ignore non-important (or is that unimportant?) outside influences.

I was once again put in my place by "Bruce," "I am your Instructor" and "CKDMAI has approved this." "Marshall" sat happily on the fence. He would tell me that he was sorting it out, apparently telling "Barry" and "Bruce" different stories. Playing one off against another.

Then, after 2 months, and 2 training sessions, "Barry" was tested by "Bruce" from IL DAN RED to IL DAN BROWN. WOW! Two months and two training sessions. A new first. The standard had fnally gone to the dogs. After I found out this via the internet chest beating and "congratulations on your test" messages, and after my "only two months and two training sessions?" questions filtered back to "Bruce," he upped me because I didn't tell him. Well, gee, maybe if I was asked, I could have said. Don't "I'm the senior rank and I need to know this stuff" me when my telepathic abilities were not obviously functioning correctly.

Anyway, we now had a "FULL EXAMINER" (and that's the way it was emailed to me all the time), that became a "FULL EXAMINER" because he lied to another who lied to another, and the lie was getting better and bigger. The toothless Tiger's spokeman "Marshall" kept on promising to come to Australia and sort it out. Why was he coming to Australia? He said it was to sort it out. That's what he said. That's what he told us. What did he tell others? What was being talked about? "Bruce" had him coning to Australia to open his new school. Ok, a bit of a stretch, but was that the real reason? Yes, "Barry" was officially informed that "Marshall" was coming to open "Bruce's" new school. Anything to do with the issues at hand? "No" not according to "Barry."

The lies and deception, the story telling and the saga was getting worse. What did CKDMAI do? Nothing. Accepted the lies, and ran with it. $2000 - $2500 a month in fees to CKDMAI, and how were they treating us/me? Like I started it. It all started over a lie. The lie still continues, even to this day.

What comes next will blow your mind!!!!

Like I said previously, "Marshall" was going to come and sort it out.

November, but November came & went... he was too busy.

December, but December came and went... he was too busy.

January. He was definately coming in January. NOPE! Too busy.

February. It was to happen! Thank the gods. NOPE! Too busy.

All this time, I wasn't going to pay a cent to an organisation that was playing people off against each other (but this is to be found out very soon). The bill was racking up. To be used against me in the end, but something I, as a consumer, was not prepared to wear, whilst the supplier made promises, that they failed to keep. I should have sacked them there and then.

Ok, you ready for it?

I get home one day, and as usual, "Marshall" was on the phone to my partner. Now, let me set the scene here a little bit. The guy used to phone, quite often at 2am to yell down the phone at us. I got jack of it, and got used to saying to her, if it's him, I'm not talking to him. If you do, that's your choice, but I'm really not interested.

So, here she was, once again, on the phone to "Marshall." The standard call where he talked at you a lot, and you just listened, like it was a recorded message. Then she started crying. This is really unusual for her, and anyone who knows her, knows that she's one tough hombray.

The crying got to me, but rather than have my head bitten off, I waited until she ended the call. What the heck happened? She said that he was being sexist, rude & derogatory to her, and ridiculing the fact that he had to deal with her, and wasn't dealing with me. She said that not only was he being sexist, rude & derogatory, he said that



Man, that's really inappropriate. Despite her trying to grab the phone off me, I rang "Marshall" and explained that I didn't care who he thought he was, and what rank in some organisation he was, that he was out of line, and really innapropriate. If he had an issue with me, tell me, tell me straight, but don't BS around the point when you talk to me, and say all the right political words to me, and then something the opposite to someone else (ie. "Barry").

I then got the next call from "Marshall." Boy, was he fired up today. It went along the lines of:



I stated that I didn't know what he was talking about, or what it related to, and how it was relevant to anything.



Sir, I don't know what your talking about. I don't know what you're aim is, but I'm not following it. Can you tell me what you mean?



Sir, if you keep this up, and don't tell me what it is exactly that you want, then I a going to hang up on you.



(HANG UP)



My partner was in shock. She said "did you just hang up on him? what did he say." I said, hang on a minute. I have a call to make. I immediately rang Choi, who's never in when I call, I must state here, however, "Linda" was in. I explained to her what had happened, what "Marshall" had just said and done, and she calmly said "but that's just him. he doesn't mean anything by it. it's just the way he is."

"Just the way he is." WOW! A 2IC acting like a school-yard bully. I was having nothing of it. 10 minutes later...

RING RING. Yes, "This is Marshall. I rang to apologise for my behaviour before." I said "anyone else would have been kicked out of the orghanisation for behaviour like that. He said "yes, and maybe I should be too, but that's not going to happen, is it?"

Wow. "Linda" must have the right connections, but how can someone be allowed to try and bully, try and intimidate, and try and manipulate people for the good of a name that apparently promotes COURTESY & INTEGRITY?

But admitting that you're wrong, admitting that you acted like a jerk, and admitting that anyone else would have been expelled, except for you, the guy's obviously not on the same level playing field as everyone else. This imbalance and one rule for one, and another rule for another was starting to really get to me.

So, to this stage, we've been lied about, we've been lied to, and we've been verbally abused on the phone. This all relating to the betterment of the CKDMAI organisation, but heck, it just keeps on going...


Then CKDMAI puts forward the concept of "Australian Seminar Series 2005"...